Transcript: Former Ba'th Party Official's Views of Iraq's Future

Salah Umar al-Ali is a former Iraqi politician and diplomat known for his opposition to the regime of Saddam Husayn and now known for his opposition to the foreign occupation. He is also known for his deep and reliable information about the politics and maneuvers of the deposed president along with the predilections and apprehensions from which he started off during his rule. He was one of the members of the leadership before disagreeing with it and being banished to the foreign service. He joined the Iraqi opposition in the early nineties of the previous century. Al-Ali experienced the days following the collapse of the regime from up close. He is living the political struggle and the direction of the situation, with Iraq falling under the occupation authority of both the US and British forces. He has carried out meetings and discussions with representatives of the various religious, tribal, and political movements and he has come up with a vision of what Iraq and its people can expect

(Al-A'sam) What are the broad outlines of this vision?

(Al-Ali) As is commonly known, there is no country that has fallen under foreign occupation and then easily gotten rid of that occupation. We have not known of a case where the occupiers left of their own volition. From the perspective of international law, peoples who fall victim to occupation do have the right to strive by various means to put an end to it. Iraq will be no exception. On the contrary we are finding, after months of occupation, that the general popular sentiment is characterized by dissatisfaction vis-à-vis the foreign military presence. I believe that any visitor to Iraq now will himself discover that all of the Iraqi population, with all of its various nationalities, religions, and sects, is looking forward to the day when they will be rid of the occupation. This has significance. The political, cultural, enlightened, and professional elite with all their organizations and institutions have entered the field of serious discussion about the format through which the occupation can be terminated at the earliest possible opportunity. Baghdad is almost an open forum of discussion about the means for restoring the countries sovereignty and its independence. This is what I sensed. The touch of a hand. I practiced some of that myself.

Moreover, the Iraqi people are demonstrating that they derive their nobility from their historical legacy. This legacy is filled with instances of highly-regarded resistance to occupation and their commitment to their patriotic, national, and religious identity. Indeed, we are coming full circle from the previous times.

(Al-A'sam) What method do you think is most practical under these circumstances for ensuring the reclamation of Iraqi sovereignty?

(Al-Ali) With respect to myself, I think that the method that is preferred and most suitable under the circumstances is the political method. This means activity among the people and mobilizing and organizing them and reviving their patriotic spirit in order to exert pressure on the occupation authority so that it will withdraw from our country. That said, I have no right to put down the other choices that serve other methods. One who chooses the path of violence must bear his own responsibility for doing so. As for me, I believe that political action at the current time is more worthwhile and more beneficial than the other methods. We have recently begun to hear that the beginnings are taking shape of a large political alliance that includes parties and personalities from outside the Governing Council. This gives me optimism for the future of Iraq and in the possibility of putting an end to the occupation in the quickest possible time.

(Al-A'sam) How can the political alternative to the occupation be viewed? What authority would take the place of the occupation authority, in your view? Would it be the authority of the Governing Council as it exists now? Would it be the authority of the previous regime, as is being promoted now? Or is there an integrated plan that is neither of the above?

(Al-Ali) First, the former regime is finished. There will not be any opportunity—not even one percent—for it to return to power. As for the alternative that we believe is appropriate for the post-occupation phase, it is represented in a plan that is being circulated among the various national political forces. Even though it is in its first stages, it embodies a political mechanism that will be agreed upon that ensures the participation of representatives from all layers of the Islamic, nationalist, and patriotic movement spectrum. It draws up a draft constitution on which a referendum will subsequently be carried out. As for the Governing Council, we will treat it as a representative power of the occupation, notwithstanding our relations with the persons representing this council. That is because it was created by a decision of the occupation forces' civilian governor, not by an Iraqi national decision. And when we talk about the necessity of ending the occupation, we are talking at the same time about the Iraqi national option that will be an alternative to the occupation.

(Al-A'sam) How far have your efforts gotten in this option taking on a clear political structure? Will it be independent from the Governing Council?

(Al-Ali) I have learned that serious attempts are underway these days to mobilize the forces of the national movement along a broad front that is outside the framework of the Governing Council. There is also an urgent endeavor to create integrated, practical formats and mechanisms for an alternative political structure. If the foreign military presence on Iraqi territory comes to an end, then general elections can be carried out at that time under neutral international supervision in preparation for transferring power to the entity in whom the Iraqi people have placed their trust. The elected entity must then work to establish the various constitutional, administrative, and legislative structures in the country.

(Al-A'sam) Relations between Iraq and the Arab and neighboring countries have been beset by complications and ruptures throughout the months that followed the fall of the regime and Iraq's falling under occupation. How do you view these relations and where they are going?

(Al-Ali) We should not forget that Iraq is one of the founding states of the Arab League. Although the former regime did many stupid things not least of which are the deep insults of all the Arab countries, no Arab country has not been subjected to such insults before. As to the subject of the Governing Council, I believe that it lacks legitimacy. The Arab brothers absolutely cannot recognize it while it is in this provisional format of governance. Diplomatic recognition will come to pass with the return of a stable and firm government. There are also firm conditions for recognizing states in the Arab League and the United Nations. These include—and are even topped by—the condition that the country is not subject to occupation. This is the reason that prompted the Arab League to hesitate in recognizing the Governing Council. But after facing external pressures, the league was inclined to adopt a compromise represented by the temporary recognition of the council and the suspension of full recognition until after the fulfillment of a whole host of conditions like the establishment of a constitution, the termination of the occupation, and the carrying out of parliamentary elections. I do not think that this position by the Arab League will leave any negative effects on the feelings of the Iraqi people. Most of them feel an affiliation toward the (Arab) Nation and this fact is not inconsistent with the existence of other nationalities, minorities, and sects within Iraq. I believe that one of the most important responsibilities of the future national authority will be to return Iraq to the Arab rank and resolve the problems with its neighbors in a spirit of partnership and common interests. It must play an active and constructive role in reviving fraternal relations with everyone.

As for the attempts to strain the relations with the Arab states, they will only come back to harm Iraq itself especially since information confirms that the Arab countries, from Egypt to Syria to Saudi Arabia and others, are preoccupied with Iraq's ordeal. They are endeavoring to get it out of this ordeal, end the occupation, and help the Iraqi people while doing the least harm.

(Al-A'sam) The position of the future Iraq on the scoreboard of the Arab-Israeli struggle provokes a lot of controversy. Some believe that it is now outside of the equation while others believe it was outside of the equation in the first place and that this struggle will not be affected by what is happening to Iraq. How do you comment to that?

(Al-Ali) By the nature of the situation, Iraq's continued fall under the occupation will have a negative effect on the equation of the Arab-Israeli struggle. If the circumstances in Iraq went back into the hands of Iraq's sons, the matter would be different. Note that the Arab-Israeli struggle has emerged from being a struggle between Palestinians and Israelis. It has become an international issue that has a strong relationship to the international balance of power. It even has a relationship to the security of the region and its stability.

As long as the legitimate rights of the Palestinian people are not met, the struggle in this region will go on. This does not mean a call to war or cheering for a military clash with the United States, which is considered to be a large and important force at the international level, not to mention being a country that possesses a huge economy and advanced technology. Even though Iraq is in urgent need of rebuilding, reconstructing, and renovating what was destroyed by the war, it is relying on the accomplishments of international technology and, primarily, American technology. Consider that America's need is for Iraq's oil and Iraq's need, conversely, is for American technology. This is a goal that can be achieved and easily agreed upon. I believe that the future national authority will be better able to assess relations with the United States, which has helped the Iraqi people get rid of the previous, dictatorial regime. But the cost of getting rid of that regime must not be occupation, the loss of sovereignty and independence, and the repression of the national will.

[Description of Source: London-based independent Iraqi daily providing coverage of Arab and international issues, including extensive reporting on Iraqi opposition activities; has an anti-Iraqi regime orientation, and is headed by the former editor of the Iraqi daily Al-Jumhuriyah]